Webinar The human-centric initial meeting

(00:04): Hello, and thank you for joining. I'm Tom. I heads of Money:Mindshift. Money:Mindshift. That is a campaign that helps advisers go beyond spreadsheets and wealth accumulation, supporting clients to make financial decisions that are not just smart, but also personally and emotionally aligned. This is our opening episode of the human-centric advice series, and in this episode, we look into the human-centric initial meeting. Let's dive right in. There are seven learning objectives associated with this webinar. We want to begin with an understanding, a definition of human centricity and human-centric advice before defining what the initial meeting is and what it isn't. We then look into a right type of preparation, both logistically and mindset wise or mentally for that type of meeting before we reflect on what does it mean to build trust and what does it mean to be a good listener.

(01:17): Then we go into the structure of an initial meeting. So this is a suggestion of how you may want to structure this, and some practical tips also on what should follow that initial meeting. Let us reflect briefly, what does it actually mean to be human-centric. This is of course, quite an important question for this particular series. Now, I'm a great believer in learning through contrasts. So what I've done here is I have distinguished between a human-centric model and a customer-centric model and a product-centric model. Let's begin with the latter. Let's begin with product-centric approach. Now, I think this is perhaps something that makes intuitive sense, right? When we were product centric, perhaps as an industry until retail distribution review, we were as an industry known for pushing a certain type of product, right? Insurance products, pension products, ISAs, investment solutions, et cetera. And I would say what happened in the aftermath of 2007, 2008 when legislation like Treat Customers Fairly came in, I mean, the clues in the name the industry became customer-centric, right?

(02:35): As in we were now concerned about disclosing risks and being transparent about costs, and client satisfaction played a much bigger role than it did before. What I would argue though is that being customer-centric still means you have a rather transactional understanding of the relationship between yourself and the recipient of your products and the recipient of your service, right? The clues in the name, again, you say a customer, and a customer, you know, it doesn't really matter whether you are a customer at, I don't know, John Lewis, a customer of a financial adviser or a customer in a cafe, right? The customer is always the recipient of a service. And I think this is different to when you have a human-centric approach. Because when you have a human-centric approach, I would say that you have an appreciation that the recipient of your service, the recipient of your product, is a human.

(03:36): And what this opens you up to appreciate is that this recipient of the products has instincts, has emotions, has vulnerabilities, is living in contexts that perhaps impede them or enable them. They have values, they have goals, they have centres, they have all those things, right? I think a human-centric approach opens you up to appreciate that. Now, I said something here about goals, and I think I would, I would invite you to reflect on goals. I think in the client-centric or customer-centric model, we had an assumption that customers were all those things there on the left-hand side. Yeah, we would assume they are, you know, in essence quite hardnosed. Yeah. So they're goal-oriented. They, they have, you know, utilitarian needs they are rational decision makers in the sense that we just need to appeal to cognition and, you know, present information in a factually correct way.

(04:46): And, you know, then they make better decisions for themselves. And of course, we, we kind of assume they're future oriented. Now, what I believe is much more often the case is they're not as much goal oriented. They're much more values driven, right? So whatever their long-term ambitions are reflects what their centres are, what really matters to them. I think they are wellbeing oriented rather than utility focused. As in it's not just about the accumulation of wealth, it's also really about other variables like health and family and purpose. And those components I think, really matter to clients as well. They are, of course not. This is an outdated model to believe that people are just rational decision makers. Of course, they are emotional. This is our makeup, right? As humans, cognition, emotion, motivation. They kind of work together in a very complex way. And this is something we want to appreciate. Also, I believe they're not people when they come to seek financial advice, they're not just future oriented. They also want to think perhaps differently about the present.

(05:59): Really what I believe what they are wondering about is what sort of trade-offs between present self and future self do I need to make for both myself and the household unit that I am in, right? So this is a bit more complex. This is a much more complex understanding of why people seek financial advice in the first place.

(06:18): Now, Let's go into the initial meeting and let's just think briefly about what that initial meeting actually is and perhaps importantly as well what it is not.

(06:32): Let us begin right there. Let's look at what the initial meeting is not. And what you see down here is the typical client adviser journey, where in my mind, it doesn't begin with the initial meeting, it begins with a screener - more onto that in a few pages. The point of the screener is, of course, just to cover some basics. Just make sure you know, the client or the prospective client at that stage is a good match, considering some basics. Okay? The initial meeting also isn't the fact-find or the discovery meeting or the planning meeting, whatever you may call it at your firm. The fact-find is there to go deeper and then of course subsequently follow client review meetings. Here, this really is the initial meeting. So let's look at what is the purpose of the initial meeting. And I bring up this particular definition here.

(07:32): The intro meeting verifies whether both the adviser and prospective client feel reassured and optimistic about their potential partnership. It's more than just capturing basic things. That's for the screening process or diving deep. That's for the fact-find. It's about making sure prospective client and adviser are a good match for each other. And how does that differ from the fact-find. Now, the fact-find has the following purpose. As you see here, the purpose of the planning meeting is the one where you really go deep, call it planning. By the way, discovery fact-find in my mind, same thing, okay? So the planning meeting takes place once you know that you and the client or the prospective client are a good match for each other. I think this is so important to understand, right? You want to know, first of all whether or not you are a good match for each other. Once that is the case, you can go deeper and then you can go into that session where you explore your client's aspirations, their centres their concerns, their core values, their goals and life objectives, et cetera, right? And this is of course subject to a webinar that follows this one, the human-centric planning meeting or the human-centric fact-find.

(09:03): Before the initial meeting, I suggest that you put out a screener, something that allows you to assess whether or not the prospective client is a good match in, in principle, in theory, considering some basics. So you would capture in here things like their name, their date of birth, whether or not they have children. Potentially you also want to ask things like, you know, what is your income, your household income? What's the value of investments? You know what, perhaps that is not necessary. Perhaps you you know, don't mind really, and you are wanting any client, but if you are somewhat established, then I suspect you probably want to know some basic things like that. I think the other thing here is that is very important. You don't want to lose valuable face-to-face time with capturing some basics like, you know, what's your name?

(10:01): And then the client sits there on the other side of the screen and you know, just sees you punching in the name, et cetera. Like those, those sorts of things. You know, that's not what you want to use that initial meeting for that valuable time that you have. Yeah. So you want to automate as much as possible of that sort of those sort of activities. Now, the other thing I would invite you to consider is to put out in that screener form to put out some statements that indicate or signal what's the type of client that you're going after. And here what I suggest is things like, you know, where they can just leave a tick next to, next to statements like you've built a strong financial foundation and are now seeking thoughtful strategic guidance to manage and grow your wealth with intention.

(11:02): Yes, this sounds like me, right? So what, what's happening here is you're signalling, you're giving an indication, of who your ideal client is. And similarly, you know, there's, there's some other formulations here on this page that you may want to use as part of the screener and you know, before they can make an appointment or book an appointment with you through Calendly or OnceHub or whatever system you're using. Iwant to reflect briefly on different types of needs that I think are important to bear in mind as you prepare for the initial meeting. And that is that there are more than the obvious needs. So this is what I call the utilitarian needs, right? So these are the needs that you're very quick to identify. So things like, you know, the prospect needs a clear understanding of the services that you offer and the potential outcomes there are.

(12:12): Then you both need to establish whether the relationship is mutually beneficial, et cetera. So these are, I would say, obvious and utilitarian needs, right? So there's obvious utility in understanding and knowing that type of stuff. But what I would encourage you to consider as well is that there are more than the utilitarian needs. What you have here on this page as well is an appreciation, or spelling out, some of the emotional needs there may be, and the social needs there may be, I'll let you pause on this page, but obviously emotionally, you know, one of the needs that the client has is the client will need to know whether or not they can trust you, okay? More on that is to follow. And social needs is, you know, they want to know whether you will really be able to support them and their household in their wider wellbeing, things like that.

(13:14): Consider that there is more than just utilitarian needs, and you want to be aware of that and want to remind yourself of that as you go into that initial meeting. Now, let's look into preparation. What do you need to do so as to prepare for the initial meeting? And I said this initially in my mind, there's a logistical side to preparation, and then there is a mental side as well. Now, let's begin with the logistical side. I think one of the things you want to make sure is that the prospective client finds as much information as possible about you on the website. So, you know, ideally there's a headshot of you something you know, that shows you in an approachable way, perhaps you will look smart, casual, but perhaps not, perhaps not in the office, perhaps not too corporate. Perhaps you're out in the botanic garden or something, okay? So, so you look approachable yet of course professional as well. Ideally there's things like testimonials. There's things like, you know, your philosophy and how you came into the profession, et cetera. All the things that perhaps ideally you don't have to tell about yourself in the short but valuable time that you have in the initial meeting, right? You don't want that initial meeting too much to be about you. Ideally, they have found this information about you so that you can concentrate on them.

(14:50): Now, the other thing you want to do is you want to send them a preparation, a meeting agenda. Yeah. And here's an example there on the right-hand side of what this email could look like. But you also want to you know, in addition, just like a bit of an agenda, right? So something that manages expectations, which I think is so important, really. Expectation management so that when they come into the situation, they're sort of mentally prepared and understand what it is that they are getting out of that meeting, what that purpose is for.

(15:28): Now, the other thing, I said this before, what is really important as well is appreciation of mindset. And this is both the client's mindset as well as your mindset. So what I think is so important to get into your head at that particular point when you're meeting a prospect first time is that you're not selling, right? You're not selling products, you're not selling services, you're not selling the company you work for. This is to understand this initial meeting is to understand whether or not you are a good fit for each other. Now, here's also another thing that I want you to reflect on. You don't want to be liked, okay? You want to be trusted and you want to be offering help, okay? So there's a fine difference here. When trust, and we come onto this, you know, has many components and components much more multifaceted than just being liked.

(16:32): And then perhaps most importantly, really what you want to use the meeting for is to understand the various needs. I mentioned this before, there's not just utilitarian needs, there are emotional needs and there are social needs, there are perhaps educational needs. There are all types of needs as well, okay? And you want to understand these, that's really the purpose of this meeting. You want to ask questions to that effect what questions again, we come to at a later stage, but further down in this webinar. The other thing though before we come to that, I want to invite you to reflect that the client also will have a mindset. And I perhaps think what is perhaps most important is to understand that there is a sort of power imbalance, right? Between you of course and the client. When you, you know, as far as the financial side goes, you know a lot about that.

(17:25): And that way, make the client feel quite, the prospective client at that stage, make them feel quite vulnerable, okay? And you want to be aware of that. There may be, I don't know, there may be regret, they may be overwhelmed, there may be anxiety, there may be shame, there may be all sorts of you know, emotions that they are not necessarily willing to share right away because of that power imbalance, right? And I think this is something that you want to bear in mind that, that mentally they are not necessarily in a good, or they, they will, they will not be volunteering all that sort of information, okay? So you want to be approaching them in a particular way, in a way that makes it easy for them to volunteer that information. Again, we come onto, you know, what questions you should be asking so as to get under the skin as much as possible. But of course you also want to appreciate that there is a deeper quality of life-oriented goal or wellbeing-oriented goal that makes them reach out, right? It's not just the emotional side. There is this wellbeing or quality of life oriented goal as well. So again, you know, you want to understand that you want to get into the client's mindset and you want to appreciate that mentally, this is something, this is a driver for them to reach out. And this is what you want to understand as you prepare for that meeting, mentally.

(18:57): I said this initially in the super structure of this series, human-centric meetings, I always want to reflect briefly on trust and why trust is so important. Now, before we go into the structure, suggestions of how you may want to structure that initial meeting, I want to reflect on the five different components to trust according to Dr. Henry Cloud, who has written a book on that particular subject. And you know, I've been really inspired by this. I think there's a lot to learn from this. In my understanding or my observation when I invite advisers to reflect on why a client or potential client trusts them. An adviser is very quick to point out their track record and their abilities. Rest assured abilities and track record are important. But the crucial point of Dr. Henry Cloud is that there are only really two components of five that matter. So what are the five?

(20:07): And this is here what he, what he invites you to think about, think along when reflecting on trust. So those five components. There's motive, there's understanding, there is track record, there is abilities, but then there's also character as well. So let's go through this briefly one by one. Motive really is about why are you in this job? So what are your underlying motives? Why, you know, what is driving you? So these are important things that you want to be really careful and considerate about what you're conveying. Understanding then is about your ability to understand the client at a deeper level in terms of what exactly it is they're actually wanting to get out of this relationship. Track record. I mean, that's kind of obvious. So this is about your experience, it's about, you know, the credentials that you have.

(21:06): Accrued ability is of course, you know, things like your training, what you have been, what what you've been taught, what you've learned, et cetera. These things, they are important. But then lastly, there's character as well and character. This is about, you know, who you are as a person, not just in the situation of, you know, where you meet the client or the prospect but in general, you know, who are you even after this meeting, when you come out of this meeting, when they bump into you in the street. Now, the point that Henry Cloud makes is that all of these are equally important, right? You can have a good level of understanding, you can have track record, you can have abilities, you can have a good character. If however you convey that the motives, you know, the motives, you're doing this because, I don't know, you're doing this to enrich your self or, for the benefit of the company, et cetera.

(22:03): If that's what you convey, your motive is then understanding track, record, ability and character, you know, won't outbalance the motives that are then in that situation, being seen as not good motives. Perhaps you have a really good motive, you have good degree of understanding, you have track record, you have abilities, et cetera. If however you convey that your character is such that you know, you're only like this in this particular situation where you're meeting the prospect or where you're meeting the client, then you know the character that will be seen as a flaw. And a client or prospective client will not trust you if they get the impression that outside of the situation you are someone entirely different. So you get it right. All those five components, they're equally important. It's not just about one of them, it's about all of them. Motive, understanding, track record, ability and character.

(23:04): We are almost getting to the initial meeting and how to structure, a suggestion of how to structure, the initial meeting. But before we do this, once again, I've got to look into something else. And this is listening. Now, listening is such an important skill and a skill that we are not really taught. I mean, when you go into a bookshop, I make this joke, you go into a bookshop, you see tons of books on how to speak, but you see hardly anything on how to listen. And Brendan Frazier, the host of the wonderful Human Side of Money podcast, and where I learned a lot from, he speaks about this 80 20 rule of thumb, where 80% of the time you should be listening and only 20% of the time you should be speaking. Now, this is very ambitious. I think this is very, very hard, probably impossible in practice, but you know, strive for it, aim for it, and I want to offer a few reflections on what it means to be a good listener.

(24:15): Now, first of all, I think it, is important to be aware that there are different levels of listening. Here's three on this page, right? Number one is you can be listening so as to just identify opportunities to speak. That's quite a superficial way of listening. Then there is a deeper way of listening, and that is one where you listen to what is being said at a deeper level. Perhaps you're filtering on some of those things that we mentioned. You know, what are emotional drivers social needs, educational needs, et cetera. But then important as well is perhaps to consider what is not being said when the prospect says something. And I want to offer a way of thinking this through systematically and methodologically with a framework that comes from a fellow German Friedemann Schulz von Thun. It's The four-sides model that again, I think is really useful.

(25:21): What Friedemann Schulz von Thun says, is that there are, to every piece that is being expressed, there are four sides to it, right? There's the factual piece of information, which we're very quick to identify, and there is a relationship message, there's a self revelation message, and then there is an appeal. And the way Thun brings that to life is by inviting you to picture this scene. There's husband and wife, they're sitting next to each other in a car she's driving and they're waiting for a red light to turn green. Now the red light turns green and he says it's green, right? So there's a factual piece of information. The traffic light has changed. Lights, there's a self revelation message here. Perhaps something to the effect of I don't know, I'm in a rush, or you're not taking me seriously, or I'd be the better driver, or whatever.

(26:23): There is relationship message in there. And the relationship message of course is, you know, well, not of course, but perhaps indicative of a long-term relationship between husband and wife. And then lastly, we have the appeal. And the appeal is of course, get going. So here you have it. It's an example of how beyond the obvious, it's green. You can very quickly if you're thinking about it systematically and methodologically, think about other dimensions, other things that are also being said when this is being said. Now, think about this in your own practice, when imagine you're meeting a prospect, someone who comes in and says, I would like to know when I can retire. And I let you pause here, I won't go through this, but it's very, you know, on reflection, it's perhaps somewhat easy to identify the other things that are or perhaps are also being said when this sentence is being expressed.

(27:24): We do not know necessarily at that state. There's a lot to unpack, but I would argue it is very quick to sort of jump on, all right, okay, well, let's figure out what's the pension pot and you know, what is the cash flow, all those situations. But the point is, there's more than the factual piece of information when someone says, I would like to know when I can retire. Right, I come onto the core of the webinar, really, and hopefully I have built a bit of suspense, but hopefully also you can see why I've done it this way. And what I want to do is give you an idea of how to structure this initial meeting. And here's a suggestion for how to get started in the very first 10 minutes of the meeting. And I've said this before, I learned a lot from Brendan Frazier and his amazing Human Side of Money podcast in particular here.

(28:22): As far as the first 10 minutes of the meeting go, I would suggest you listen to an episode that he recorded with Natalie Taylor. Here's the link. You may be quicker to find this on Google, but go, if you're short for time, go to minute 45 and listen to three minutes for three minutes to how exactly it sounds like in this meeting when you are a prospect of Natalie Taylor and reflect why that makes the prospect probably feel very, very good. So when you listen to this, what you will see is or hear is that she asks this question, what brought you in today? And I think this is a tremendous first question, is much better than the question, how can I help? Because when you invite a client to reflect, how can I help, then obviously, you know, here they are sitting with a financial adviser and they will go, well, what else can the adviser help me than with the financial side of things?

(29:29): Yeah, if, however you ask this question of what brought you in today, you are opening up a much or inviting a much wider range of views and needs to be expressed than if you simply asked, how can I help? This is why I think it's a really, really good question to ask. The other question, a good follow up question that is also being suggested here, is to ask why now and again, I think this is a really great way of getting more information out of the prospect client that will be very relevant for you so as to understand whether or not the client is a good match. Because the fact is you're not meeting the client a month ago or a year ago or a week ago and not in a month's time and not in a year's time or not in a week's time.

(30:23): You're meeting them now and there will be reasons for why that is, right? There will have been something a, a trigger perhaps not necessarily a, sort of big life moment, but perhaps something that's crept up on them, but perhaps there was also, you know, an event that that broke the camel's back, right? So that there will be something as to why they reached out now, and it will be useful for you to understand that in this main part of the initial meeting, you want to understand what are the deeper reasons for reaching out to you in the first place. Moira Summers has written a great book called Advice That Sticks. You see that here in the footnote, and she makes the point in those initials pages of the book that when people seek a financial adviser, they are trying to satisfy a range of, you know, emotional needs.

(31:27): Things back a little bit to what I said initially, we're very quick to identify the utilitarian needs, but there are more than those utilitarian needs. So she's speaking especially about emotional needs, and I think it is important for you to understand what the emotional needs are because these are ultimately the needs that you are seeking to satisfy down the road. Okay? So here are some examples of what emotional needs are. There are other ones things like, you know, they want to have someone else to blame. Perhaps they are doing someone else a favor that there is a range of emotional, a range of emotional needs in addition to those that are on this page. The other point that I'm making here is you want to ask questions that allow you to understand what the client's centres are. When I say centres, I'm referring to that notion of centers as established by Steve Covey in the Seven Habits of Highly Effective People, where he makes the point that different people have different centres.

(32:27): Yeah, so some people are family centered, some people are partner centered. That's quite common. Some people are work-centred, perhaps others are wealth centred, others are money centred, et cetera. I think in my experience, advisers are quick to assume that the clients are money centred and wealth centred. And to be fair, that is the case sometimes, but it isn't the case. I don't think as often as advisers assume it's to be the case. So this is why listening is really important because you know, in some cases absolutely the client will be money centered. Absolutely, they will be wealth centred as a result. Talking money, talking performance, talking asset allocation, et cetera. These things will be important, but in many instances it won't be the case, right? So you want to sort of adapt and tailor according to what their needs and what their centres are.

(33:20): And then in the final 10 minutes of that initial meeting, I think a good thing to ask would be what would success in a year's time look like? There's a few things going on here. Number one is you're planting a bit of a seed, right? So now they are sort of mentally in this question, they're mentally buying into a relationship, okay? And it is now almost theirs to lose because, you know, they're like mentally committed to it. However, in addition to that, it is really an opportunity to identify any you know, false impressions or false expectations. There may be, I mean, an obvious example would be that if the client says something like, in a year's time, I want to have doubled my retirement pension size, pension pot size, yeah. Then you know, obviously there is a mismatch and that gives you an opportunity to clarify, but it is also perhaps the opportunity to, you know, identify that this client isn't a good match.

(34:26): Now, that's a quite obvious crass example perhaps, but you get it and you get how this may also apply and sort of finer variations of that example. Really bear in mind the purpose of that initial meeting is to understand whether or not the client is a good fit. And asking that question, what would success in a year's time look like might help you understand or gather that information to, to come to that conclusion whether or not in fact they are right. So that is it a very brief structure, suggested structure for an initial meeting. I want to very briefly reflect on what happens after the meeting. Now the main point, of course, I said it now a few times, but I'm really hammering this point in the purpose of that initial meeting is to understand whether or not the client is a good match.

(35:18): And when you assess this after the meeting, there may be a number of variables to consider. Yeah. So as to come to a conclusion and so as to come to a decision, assets, character, household income life stage, et cetera, all those things. Some are more, you know, harder variables, some are softer variables. Perhaps you have a very clear understanding of what client, type of client, you want to work with. Perhaps you can very vividly describe your ideal client. Now, chances are your ideal client isn't just defined by assets under management, but there are other variables as well, and that is what you want to think along. Okay? So you want to have clarity on the variables that matter. These are the clients that you want to work with. This is the book that you want to build. This is ultimately further down the line, the type of client who will provide the referrals so as to allow you to get more clients of this particular type.

(36:17): Okay? So this is, this is how it all hangs together eventually in the end. And then of course you want to follow up with an email. This is something that you would've expressed at the end of the meeting as well in those last final five to 10 minutes. That, so in the next couple of days, expect an email from me where I explain, you know, why or whether or not I think we're a good match. You will provide an explanation and you will also be clear with regards to next steps. Here's an example of what this could look like. Very quick, I will just bring it up, not voice it over, but you can pause and, and and, and study the detail you see here. On the left-hand side, we have the explanation for a client for why they are considered a good match. And on the right hand side there, there's a variation for if the client is perhaps not a good match.

(37:22): And that very much sums us up. Here we are. That concludes the first session of the human-centric advice series. In this episode, we looked into human-centric initial meeting and these were the subjects that we covered. We reflected, what does it mean to be human-centric in the first place. We defined that initial meeting and contrasted it with other types of meetings. We then looked into preparation, both on the logistical and the mindset side. We reflected on what does it mean to be trustworthy. We reflected on what does it mean to be a good listener. And then we looked into a brief structure of the meeting before I offered a bit of guidance, or some suggestions, on what you may want to do and how you want to approach what happens after the meeting. Thank you for watching. I hope that was useful to you.

(38:24): Remember, Money:Mindshift is here to help, especially those financial advisers who are keen to become financial planners, life planners, with a strong financial component and money mind shift's. Purpose really is to look beyond the spreadsheets and help people use the money they have or the resources they have, so as to live the lives they want to live for, which we believe financial advisers play a crucial role. Thank you for watching and watch this space for more material.